Comments on: What God Has Joined Together: A Study of Grace and Discipleship In The Teaching of Jesus

By: Boekbespreking: De derde Jezus « Vensters op het evangelie…

Boekbespreking: De derde Jezus « Vensters op het evangelie… — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 19:41:19 +0000

[...] Volgens Chopra is het – met name voor christenen – niet mogelijk gebleken om volgens de gulden regel van Jezus te leven ( Matteüs 7:12): ”Behandel anderen dus steeds zoals je zou willen dat ze jullie behandelen.” Hij noemt deze regel het grondbeginsel van het christendom. De gulden regel is echter niet in overeenstemming met de menselijke natuur. Jezus zou daarom ontoereikend onderwijs hebben gegeven. Jezus wees als oplossing en ideaal op de kracht van het koninkrijk (het rijk van de ziel). Daarin kan ik Chopra enigszins volgen. Jezus wilde een wereld inspireren die was wedergeboren in God, maar hij slaagde niet in zijn missie. Zijn volgelingen waren volstrekt niet in staat om te leven zoals Jezus van hen verlangde (een aantal zeer negatieve kwalificaties laat ik hier ongenoemd). Chopra noemt die constatering de schaduwkant van hun nieuwe geloof. Het christendom, zo vervolgt hij, moest een compromis sluiten met het visioen van Jezus. Het alternatief – een volledige transformatie van de menselijke aard – bleek onmogelijk. Misschien aardig in deze context de visie van The Internet Monk [...]

By: T

Mon, 01 Jun 2009 16:16:23 +0000

This discussion reminds me of the passage in Acts that describes the church as in “the fear of God and the comfort of the Holy Spirit.” God’s mercy is great comfort and also a command to do likewise. It is an overly funded mandate.

By: T

Mon, 01 Jun 2009 16:05:53 +0000

And Sue,

I wasn’t (nor am I) advocating that we start throwing people off the bus of God’s mercy. I thank God for I John 1:9 and the rest of it, even if the rest of the book is less comforting. I am saying that Jesus is warning Peter specifically and everyone generally that [our] Father will throw people out who act like the servant in this passage. If that doesn’t put a little fear of God into you, okay. It does me.

Thankfully, this is not all Jesus said or demonstrated to be true about God; he is also much more than what Jesus reveals in this warning, but he is not less.

By: sue kephart

sue kephart — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 16:04:15 +0000

I no longer fear God , I love Him.

By: T

Mon, 01 Jun 2009 15:35:04 +0000

Sue,

I try to trust whatever Jesus tells me about God, and he does tell me that he is more loving than anyone. I don’t think that means I have to deny that the line spoken to Peter after that parable is scary–and obviously intended to be so. The whole parable is a warning; it’s sobering. It’s not even a subtle threat; it’s just in plain terms: this is exactly how your Father will treat you unless . . .

Jesus doesn’t often spell out the point of his parables at the end, but he does in this one–and how. I think the only way anyone could honestly read what Jesus says and not swallow hard (or breath deep, or something to calm down) is if they’ve been given some pretty powerful theological lenses to (selectively) read with.

It’s okay to be scared sometimes–of the one who has the power to throw the soul into hell, however reluctantly he may do it. I’ve taught my daughter to be scared of cars in the road. She should be as a 4 year old. They can kill her and she can’t afford to learn that by experience. Jesus seems, in the plainest of terms, to be giving the grown up version about ultimate death and lack of mercy to others.

By: sue kephart

sue kephart — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:47:02 +0000

Boy, T, That’s not a very loving and merciful God you believe in. And the parable is scary? Why?

I find I John 1:9 comforting. Of course I have to confess I am a sinner. OK, OK, I am one. So He forgives me. I like that. God who is just has justified me. What is my response? That’s the question.

So far Jesus hasn’t kicked me off the bus and I am far from perfect. So maybe I shouldn’t kick some else off either. Just maybe I should pray for them. Treat them with the Love of Christ. How’s that for an idea?

By: T

Mon, 01 Jun 2009 14:29:08 +0000

I think the thrust of your argument is a major motivating force within the emerging church. They don’t care if it’s the Protestant version or the Catholic of ‘how’. They care if Christians who supposedly received the biggest mercy ever are going to live like it. Neither view of how (Catholic or Protestant) is in the story anyway, and the letters, like the one you referenced, don’t tidy things up any, they just keep them all intertwined. First John gets quoted for 1:9, but the book as a whole is as scary as this parable and for the same reasons: We know we belong to him because we . . .

It seems we want to know how we can be shown mercy without getting on the mercy bus. Jesus says don’t bet on it. Either get on it, receiving mercy and giving it, or get off.

By: Memphis Aggie

Memphis Aggie — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 12:41:40 +0000

“ No, not seven times,” Jesus replied, “but seventy times seven!

And I’m going to need every one of them. Great post I love that ungrateful servant story to , very clear and true to life.

By: Sherwood MacRae

Sherwood MacRae — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 11:37:31 +0000

The greater problem with truth is our unwillingness to walk in it. We are much too willing to walk in the light – or darkness, offered by the flesh and blood of our day.

Jesus made it very clear – you (not the other person) must be born again and once the process has begun, the truth become more obvious and once revealed, holds us in place.

By: Davina Stallworth

Davina Stallworth — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 05:37:15 +0000

With me, no matter what religions we are into as long as we believes that there are someone who guided us above, someone who is Supreme. No matter what “names” we call HIM, as long as we have faith in HIM.

Just Pray, this is a perfect way to communicate with HIM.