Comments on: To Do The Best With What We Have: A Counselor’s Meditation http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation ...dispatches from the post-evangelical wilderness Thu, 08 Jan 2009 18:27:22 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5 By: Andy Wood http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-186230 Andy Wood Mon, 14 Jan 2008 05:13:04 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-186230 Having lived on both sides of the thin divide you have described, what filled me most with wonder and encouragement (as both the wounded and the wounded healer) is your amazing statement of hope at the "absurdity" of continuing on. I get it. Despite the repeated efforts to prove to God was a bit nuts in His pursuit of me, He quietly, stubbornly, kept pursuing. I could try to pretend to be somebody else, but at the end of the day, I was still His, and still called by Him. Having progressed through my self-image models from David (I've blown it and found grace) to Samson (I'm out of control) to Saul (I'm completely crazy) to Paul (the chief of sinners, who is who he is by the grace of God), I am now free to say to other pastors and their families: "The end of the story hasn't been told about you yet." Thank you for the most profound description of this dynamic I have ever read. Having lived on both sides of the thin divide you have described, what filled me most with wonder and encouragement (as both the wounded and the wounded healer) is your amazing statement of hope at the “absurdity” of continuing on. I get it. Despite the repeated efforts to prove to God was a bit nuts in His pursuit of me, He quietly, stubbornly, kept pursuing. I could try to pretend to be somebody else, but at the end of the day, I was still His, and still called by Him.

Having progressed through my self-image models from David (I’ve blown it and found grace) to Samson (I’m out of control) to Saul (I’m completely crazy) to Paul (the chief of sinners, who is who he is by the grace of God), I am now free to say to other pastors and their families: “The end of the story hasn’t been told about you yet.”

Thank you for the most profound description of this dynamic I have ever read.

]]> By: joannmski http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-186117 joannmski Sun, 13 Jan 2008 22:22:22 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-186117 Thanks for this post. I linked you to a pastor's wives forum, and 14 women responded having read your post with tears, goose bumps, or generally a feeling of relief that someone understands. Thanks for this post. I linked you to a pastor’s wives forum, and 14 women responded having read your post with tears, goose bumps, or generally a feeling of relief that someone understands.

]]> By: Pastor M http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-185322 Pastor M Sat, 12 Jan 2008 15:47:50 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-185322 I turned 60 Thursday with some 32 years of service as a pastor. My wife and I talked a little about retirement which is only a few years away. She talked about us starting some kind of ministry for pastors and families who face the very issues that you discussed so well. I like the idea, and we will continue to pray, discuss, and share the idea with others to get insight and wisdom that they may have. We have had pain along the way, but have also been blessed with an incredible group of friends, most of whom joined us last night for a birthday celebration, including our bishop. So, we will be asking God to lead us in this ministry and would appreciate any advice, insight, suggested resources, etc. I turned 60 Thursday with some 32 years of service as a pastor. My wife and I talked a little about retirement which is only a few years away. She talked about us starting some kind of ministry for pastors and families who face the very issues that you discussed so well. I like the idea, and we will continue to pray, discuss, and share the idea with others to get insight and wisdom that they may have. We have had pain along the way, but have also been blessed with an incredible group of friends, most of whom joined us last night for a birthday celebration, including our bishop.

So, we will be asking God to lead us in this ministry and would appreciate any advice, insight, suggested resources, etc.

]]> By: dumb ox http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-185209 dumb ox Sat, 12 Jan 2008 06:48:24 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-185209 (My comment about inner-communication was meant to be sarcastic. My apologies for not noting this.) (My comment about inner-communication was meant to be sarcastic. My apologies for not noting this.)

]]> By: dumb ox http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-185189 dumb ox Sat, 12 Jan 2008 05:45:41 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-185189 Michael: Very good post. Such honesty wouldn't be permitted under the gospel according to Osteen: something is obviously wrong with your inner-communication. Paul said that works not performed in faith are sin. Our works are always imperfect and are only sanctified by the blood of Christ. I think this is often left out of American evangelicalism, to the destruction of both pastor and parishoner equally. If pastors feel under the thumb to be supermen, it's no wonder they burn-out so quickly. Parishoners should preach gospel to their pastors, as much as pastors should preach gospel to them. (Ah, liturgy to the rescue again: "The Lord be with you, congregation."..."And also with you, pastor.") Michael:

Very good post. Such honesty wouldn’t be permitted under the gospel according to Osteen: something is obviously wrong with your inner-communication.

Paul said that works not performed in faith are sin. Our works are always imperfect and are only sanctified by the blood of Christ. I think this is often left out of American evangelicalism, to the destruction of both pastor and parishoner equally. If pastors feel under the thumb to be supermen, it’s no wonder they burn-out so quickly. Parishoners should preach gospel to their pastors, as much as pastors should preach gospel to them. (Ah, liturgy to the rescue again: “The Lord be with you, congregation.”…”And also with you, pastor.”)

]]> By: Ken http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184763 Ken Fri, 11 Jan 2008 17:03:01 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184763 <i>The tendency these days is to project the image of the minister as young, absurdly happy, socially perfect and free from care and hang-ups.</i> i.e. what Totem to Temple called "Shiny Happy Christian (TM)". Well, I'm not "Shiny Happy". I've never been wrapped all that tight, and I know it. Sometimes the only thing that keeps me going is what the Marines call "Charlie Mike": Continue Mission. The tendency these days is to project the image of the minister as young, absurdly happy, socially perfect and free from care and hang-ups.

i.e. what Totem to Temple called “Shiny Happy Christian (TM)”.

Well, I’m not “Shiny Happy”. I’ve never been wrapped all that tight, and I know it. Sometimes the only thing that keeps me going is what the Marines call “Charlie Mike”: Continue Mission.

]]> By: Loreli C http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184753 Loreli C Fri, 11 Jan 2008 16:40:27 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184753 Me too. Thanks. Me too. Thanks.

]]> By: Irenicum http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184725 Irenicum Fri, 11 Jan 2008 15:45:43 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184725 Thank you Michael. I get very discouraged in my own brokeness as I consider what God has called me to. Your words cut through to the quick of what's underneath. Thanks again. Thank you Michael. I get very discouraged in my own brokeness as I consider what God has called me to. Your words cut through to the quick of what’s underneath. Thanks again.

]]> By: Paul http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184716 Paul Fri, 11 Jan 2008 15:36:36 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184716 Another home run! Man, brother this article and the other recent one that you wrote about not quitting have been very, encouraging to my soul. Have you considered writing a 'Pastoral Theology' handbook? :) Another home run! Man, brother this article and the other recent one that you wrote about not quitting have been very, encouraging to my soul. Have you considered writing a ‘Pastoral Theology’ handbook? :)

]]> By: Skerrib http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184649 Skerrib Fri, 11 Jan 2008 13:58:48 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/to-do-the-best-with-what-we-have-a-counselors-meditation#comment-184649 Yep. Thank you. Yep. Thank you.

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