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	<title>Comments on: The Unresolved Tensions of Evangelicalism Part 1: The Biblical Worldview</title>
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	<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview</link>
	<description>...dispatches from the post-evangelical wilderness</description>
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		<title>By: kim</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-346329</link>
		<dc:creator>kim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 05:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-346329</guid>
		<description>But Jesus was a liberal!  He would hate Biblical Literalism.  It binds you and distracts you from what is important in life.  The greatest of these is charity (love) -- remember that one?  The Good Samaritan?  Remember him?  Give all your goods to the poor and follow me?  Remember that?  Those are the kinds of things that were important to Jesus.  Feed the poor (not the deserving poor, the poor...), love your neighbor as yourself.  Love your enemies.  Pay all jobs the same amount.  (yes, that&#039;s in there too, if you like being literal.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But Jesus was a liberal!  He would hate Biblical Literalism.  It binds you and distracts you from what is important in life.  The greatest of these is charity (love) &#8212; remember that one?  The Good Samaritan?  Remember him?  Give all your goods to the poor and follow me?  Remember that?  Those are the kinds of things that were important to Jesus.  Feed the poor (not the deserving poor, the poor&#8230;), love your neighbor as yourself.  Love your enemies.  Pay all jobs the same amount.  (yes, that&#8217;s in there too, if you like being literal.)</p>
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		<title>By: dumb ox</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-324576</link>
		<dc:creator>dumb ox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 23:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-324576</guid>
		<description>(The Ed Young post closed while I was attempting to add a comment.  What I wanted to say really had more to do with this post, so may I place it here?)

Anyone who could rub two active brain cells together should be able to discern what Ed Young is teaching is wrong.  But since critical thinking is a slippery slope into liberalism, no one dares!  No wonder evangelicalism has become so guttural.  Evangelicals feel bound to respond to every manipulation of primal fear or irrational emotions or base desires.  But thank goodness that we are safe from the critial thinking of liberalism!  I feel so proud to call myself conservative!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(The Ed Young post closed while I was attempting to add a comment.  What I wanted to say really had more to do with this post, so may I place it here?)</p>
<p>Anyone who could rub two active brain cells together should be able to discern what Ed Young is teaching is wrong.  But since critical thinking is a slippery slope into liberalism, no one dares!  No wonder evangelicalism has become so guttural.  Evangelicals feel bound to respond to every manipulation of primal fear or irrational emotions or base desires.  But thank goodness that we are safe from the critial thinking of liberalism!  I feel so proud to call myself conservative!</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Sacamento</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323818</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Sacamento</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 16:47:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323818</guid>
		<description>uhhh, that&#039;s blinders, not &quot;bliners&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>uhhh, that&#8217;s blinders, not &#8220;bliners&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Sacamento</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323817</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Sacamento</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 16:46:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323817</guid>
		<description>iMonk,

I know I sound flustered.  I hope I don&#039;t sound angry.  I &lt;i&gt;am&lt;/i&gt; confused.  I get the impression Wicker has some severe bliners on.  And I&#039;m having a hard time separating her conclusions from yours.  Will wait for part five.  Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>iMonk,</p>
<p>I know I sound flustered.  I hope I don&#8217;t sound angry.  I <i>am</i> confused.  I get the impression Wicker has some severe bliners on.  And I&#8217;m having a hard time separating her conclusions from yours.  Will wait for part five.  Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: iMonk</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323807</link>
		<dc:creator>iMonk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 16:24:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323807</guid>
		<description>Bob Scaramento: The series will have five parts, and the fifth will be my response.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bob Scaramento: The series will have five parts, and the fifth will be my response.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Sacamento</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323793</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Sacamento</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 15:54:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323793</guid>
		<description>Couple of things:

&lt;i&gt;But she [Wicker] is saying that when you move away from strict and defining fundamentals and start thinking critically, then a process begins. It starts with a C.S. Lewis and ends with a Brian Mclaren and beyond.&lt;/i&gt;

This is exactly what I was trying to get at in my first comment.  This process &lt;i&gt;was not&lt;/i&gt; evangelicalism losing its way.  This process &lt;i&gt;was&lt;/i&gt; evangelicalism from the get go.  (I&#039;m sure you have read Ockenga and Henry!)  I haven&#039;t read Wicker&#039;s book, but if she doesn&#039;t get this, then she completely misunderstands her entire subject matter.  Maybe what she (and you?) are really trying to say is that evangelicalism was always a lost cause, carrying the seeds of its own destruction from the beginning, and that the only true alternatives are the fundamentalism it grew out of, and modernist secularism?  I&#039;m really confused.  And, come on, in what sense does C.S. Lewis lead to Brian McLaren?  I don&#039;t know many people at all who really like them both.

&lt;i&gt;Sooner or later you wind up with a kid who was brought up in a Christian home but is a universalist, etc. Because you told him to think critically and live with modernity.&lt;/i&gt;

Living with modernity and thinking critically are two different things and shouldn&#039;t be conflated.  Alot of people will argue that they are in fact contradictory.

Sorry Michael.  This post doesn&#039;t sound like you in alot of ways, and it doesn&#039;t sound like your are merely reporting Wicker&#039;s views either.  I am confused.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Couple of things:</p>
<p><i>But she [Wicker] is saying that when you move away from strict and defining fundamentals and start thinking critically, then a process begins. It starts with a C.S. Lewis and ends with a Brian Mclaren and beyond.</i></p>
<p>This is exactly what I was trying to get at in my first comment.  This process <i>was not</i> evangelicalism losing its way.  This process <i>was</i> evangelicalism from the get go.  (I&#8217;m sure you have read Ockenga and Henry!)  I haven&#8217;t read Wicker&#8217;s book, but if she doesn&#8217;t get this, then she completely misunderstands her entire subject matter.  Maybe what she (and you?) are really trying to say is that evangelicalism was always a lost cause, carrying the seeds of its own destruction from the beginning, and that the only true alternatives are the fundamentalism it grew out of, and modernist secularism?  I&#8217;m really confused.  And, come on, in what sense does C.S. Lewis lead to Brian McLaren?  I don&#8217;t know many people at all who really like them both.</p>
<p><i>Sooner or later you wind up with a kid who was brought up in a Christian home but is a universalist, etc. Because you told him to think critically and live with modernity.</i></p>
<p>Living with modernity and thinking critically are two different things and shouldn&#8217;t be conflated.  Alot of people will argue that they are in fact contradictory.</p>
<p>Sorry Michael.  This post doesn&#8217;t sound like you in alot of ways, and it doesn&#8217;t sound like your are merely reporting Wicker&#8217;s views either.  I am confused.</p>
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		<title>By: KM</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323517</link>
		<dc:creator>KM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 01:47:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323517</guid>
		<description>&quot;They will grow weary of believing and being told they don’t believe.&quot;

Thank you for this sentence.  It almost brought me to tears.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;They will grow weary of believing and being told they don’t believe.&#8221;</p>
<p>Thank you for this sentence.  It almost brought me to tears.</p>
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		<title>By: cey</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323180</link>
		<dc:creator>cey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Nov 2008 04:58:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323180</guid>
		<description>imonk, 
One of my absolute favorite books is &quot;Love your God with all your mind&quot; by Moreland. I appreciate where you are coming from a great deal, and I tend to focus on these issues as well. I would do well to remember, however, that the intellectual aspect, and the intellectual answers to the very real issues and problems is one leg of the table, so to speak. People are not argued into the Kingdom. We must be prepared to give an answer for the hope that we have.

But are there not any more Billy Grahams walking in the woods, placing their Bibles on a stump and declaring openly to the Lord &quot;I don&#039;t understand all that is in Your Word, but I accept it by faith&quot; 

Or what about a Robertson McQuilken standing on the Japanese coast hearing a still small voice ask &quot;Are you smarter than Jesus?&quot;as he was wrestling with the lures of agnosticism. 

A person who says that they need to have every issue explained so that he understands it before he accepts Christ Jesus as Lord and lives for Him will likely never put his trust in Him. 

But you are right, we need to wrestle with, study, research and investigate both the Word and the issues that are confronting the Church.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>imonk,<br />
One of my absolute favorite books is &#8220;Love your God with all your mind&#8221; by Moreland. I appreciate where you are coming from a great deal, and I tend to focus on these issues as well. I would do well to remember, however, that the intellectual aspect, and the intellectual answers to the very real issues and problems is one leg of the table, so to speak. People are not argued into the Kingdom. We must be prepared to give an answer for the hope that we have.</p>
<p>But are there not any more Billy Grahams walking in the woods, placing their Bibles on a stump and declaring openly to the Lord &#8220;I don&#8217;t understand all that is in Your Word, but I accept it by faith&#8221; </p>
<p>Or what about a Robertson McQuilken standing on the Japanese coast hearing a still small voice ask &#8220;Are you smarter than Jesus?&#8221;as he was wrestling with the lures of agnosticism. </p>
<p>A person who says that they need to have every issue explained so that he understands it before he accepts Christ Jesus as Lord and lives for Him will likely never put his trust in Him. </p>
<p>But you are right, we need to wrestle with, study, research and investigate both the Word and the issues that are confronting the Church.</p>
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		<title>By: j. Michael Jones</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323060</link>
		<dc:creator>j. Michael Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 19:38:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323060</guid>
		<description>Yes Michael S. I knew that you were talking about the tension of creationism being relieved at Christian colleges.  What I was trying to say (about Wheaton and others) was not meant to be oppositional, but more tangential.  I wasn’t saying, “You’re wrong because” but more “You’re right and here is a tangential point (about other areas of tension that may be created in a Christian school environment).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes Michael S. I knew that you were talking about the tension of creationism being relieved at Christian colleges.  What I was trying to say (about Wheaton and others) was not meant to be oppositional, but more tangential.  I wasn’t saying, “You’re wrong because” but more “You’re right and here is a tangential point (about other areas of tension that may be created in a Christian school environment).</p>
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		<title>By: Fr. Ernesto</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unresolved-tensions-of-evangelicalism-part-1-the-biblical-worldview/comment-page-1#comment-323048</link>
		<dc:creator>Fr. Ernesto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 18:52:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2552#comment-323048</guid>
		<description>This was such a good post. Someone earlier cited that C.S. Lewis and G.K Chesterton were respectively Anglican and Roman Catholic. Let me point out that John Stott is a Priest as is J.I. Packer (Anglican). In fact, quite a few of the most beloved Evangelical writers were not necessarily Evangelical alone.

John Stott and J.I. Packer would classify themselves as evangelicals, but they are in a Tradition where a connection to the Early Church is highly valued. And that connection is not merely scholarly, but liturgical, ecclessiological, etc. C.S. Lewis and G.K. Chesterton are even more so in that camp.

I would argue that without Tradition to keep you in check, without the willingness to look back and read so that one may know what were some of the acceptable parameters of Christian thought, then either theology becomes a logical battleground where almost anything can be argued to be Christian or, as you pointed out, limits are set that may or may not be true to what Christians have believed and/or allowed.

It is interesting to note that Anglicans are in a major worldwide battle precisely because the American Episcopal Church decided to openly give up its connection with Tradition. Once that was given up, it was not long before the American Episcopal Church started having serious problems. There was neither a way to keep &quot;liberals&quot; in check nor any way to call &quot;conservatives&quot; away from inappropriate beliefs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This was such a good post. Someone earlier cited that C.S. Lewis and G.K Chesterton were respectively Anglican and Roman Catholic. Let me point out that John Stott is a Priest as is J.I. Packer (Anglican). In fact, quite a few of the most beloved Evangelical writers were not necessarily Evangelical alone.</p>
<p>John Stott and J.I. Packer would classify themselves as evangelicals, but they are in a Tradition where a connection to the Early Church is highly valued. And that connection is not merely scholarly, but liturgical, ecclessiological, etc. C.S. Lewis and G.K. Chesterton are even more so in that camp.</p>
<p>I would argue that without Tradition to keep you in check, without the willingness to look back and read so that one may know what were some of the acceptable parameters of Christian thought, then either theology becomes a logical battleground where almost anything can be argued to be Christian or, as you pointed out, limits are set that may or may not be true to what Christians have believed and/or allowed.</p>
<p>It is interesting to note that Anglicans are in a major worldwide battle precisely because the American Episcopal Church decided to openly give up its connection with Tradition. Once that was given up, it was not long before the American Episcopal Church started having serious problems. There was neither a way to keep &#8220;liberals&#8221; in check nor any way to call &#8220;conservatives&#8221; away from inappropriate beliefs.</p>
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