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	<title>Comments on: The Unlikely Command of Holy Joy</title>
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	<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy</link>
	<description>...dispatches from the post-evangelical wilderness</description>
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		<title>By: Christopher Lake</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-339151</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher Lake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 00:17:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-339151</guid>
		<description>Today, the main preaching elder at my church proclaimed from the Bible that the kingdom of God is already here, all around us, if we have the spiritual eyes to see it.  Jesus brought the kingdom, and thus, it is already here-- not yet fully realized, to be sure, but truly here!  *That* is cause for joy!  

The elder also preached the realities of sin and judgment, but he did so in order to call unbelievers to come into the kingdom through Christ, so that they can be forgiven of their sins and have peace with God and the resultant joy.  I am so thankful for Christ-centered sermons!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Today, the main preaching elder at my church proclaimed from the Bible that the kingdom of God is already here, all around us, if we have the spiritual eyes to see it.  Jesus brought the kingdom, and thus, it is already here&#8211; not yet fully realized, to be sure, but truly here!  *That* is cause for joy!  </p>
<p>The elder also preached the realities of sin and judgment, but he did so in order to call unbelievers to come into the kingdom through Christ, so that they can be forgiven of their sins and have peace with God and the resultant joy.  I am so thankful for Christ-centered sermons!</p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-338689</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 05:09:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-338689</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;How many are told that the “strength” of faith is our serious efforts at obedience and surrender, when all the while “the Joy of the Lord is your strength?”&lt;/i&gt;

Our pastor teaches that there is no way we are able to live up to the moral demands of Jesus(and the New Testament) out of our own power. So far so good. The only way we can do that is through the empowerment of the Spirit. So we must somehow let Jesus &quot;flow&quot; through us so that those moral demands can be met. 

Is this how it&#039;s really supposed to work? Does this fit with the Gospel? Is this what the &quot;in Christ&quot; relationship is all about? Cause it&#039;s about to drive me crazy. If I do not have the power to choose to love my wife as I should(and I don&#039;t) then how do I have the power to &quot;step aside&quot; and let Jesus&#039; power flow through me?

This is a major focal point of what our pastor teaches and it comes up almost every Sunday. I&#039;ve labeled it &quot;Spirit Enabled Moralism&quot; and I just need to know if he is off base or I&#039;m a lousy Christian.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>How many are told that the “strength” of faith is our serious efforts at obedience and surrender, when all the while “the Joy of the Lord is your strength?”</i></p>
<p>Our pastor teaches that there is no way we are able to live up to the moral demands of Jesus(and the New Testament) out of our own power. So far so good. The only way we can do that is through the empowerment of the Spirit. So we must somehow let Jesus &#8220;flow&#8221; through us so that those moral demands can be met. </p>
<p>Is this how it&#8217;s really supposed to work? Does this fit with the Gospel? Is this what the &#8220;in Christ&#8221; relationship is all about? Cause it&#8217;s about to drive me crazy. If I do not have the power to choose to love my wife as I should(and I don&#8217;t) then how do I have the power to &#8220;step aside&#8221; and let Jesus&#8217; power flow through me?</p>
<p>This is a major focal point of what our pastor teaches and it comes up almost every Sunday. I&#8217;ve labeled it &#8220;Spirit Enabled Moralism&#8221; and I just need to know if he is off base or I&#8217;m a lousy Christian.</p>
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		<title>By: Carolyn</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337449</link>
		<dc:creator>Carolyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 02:16:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337449</guid>
		<description>IMONK, thanks for the post. The scriptures used are beautiful...beautiful...words of HOPE eternal....the &#039;good news&#039; of Christ&#039;s redemptive act.  Through the death of His soul....mine has found life.  I feel as the people of Israel...I should just put my face to the ground and weep over my unworthiness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IMONK, thanks for the post. The scriptures used are beautiful&#8230;beautiful&#8230;words of HOPE eternal&#8230;.the &#8216;good news&#8217; of Christ&#8217;s redemptive act.  Through the death of His soul&#8230;.mine has found life.  I feel as the people of Israel&#8230;I should just put my face to the ground and weep over my unworthiness.</p>
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		<title>By: Carolyn</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337440</link>
		<dc:creator>Carolyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 02:04:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337440</guid>
		<description>JOY is a holy presence that only the redeemed can know.  Joy is way beyond emotions of happiness, excitement, or delight.  Joy is the literal emotion of holiness spilling from the heart of God into the human heart. Joy cannot be solicited nor  demanded. It comes only when willed by God. Joy fills the heart to overflowing with a promise of total acceptance...eternal peace. Joy proves &#039;peace on earth...good will towards men.&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JOY is a holy presence that only the redeemed can know.  Joy is way beyond emotions of happiness, excitement, or delight.  Joy is the literal emotion of holiness spilling from the heart of God into the human heart. Joy cannot be solicited nor  demanded. It comes only when willed by God. Joy fills the heart to overflowing with a promise of total acceptance&#8230;eternal peace. Joy proves &#8216;peace on earth&#8230;good will towards men.&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: Fr. Ernesto</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337345</link>
		<dc:creator>Fr. Ernesto</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 23:26:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337345</guid>
		<description>What a wonderful post! Steve, the Orthodox/Armenian/Wesleyan types among us would express it identically.

St. John Chrysostom&#039;s Easter sermon says things very close to what iMonk has said:

&quot;Is there anyone who is a devout lover of God?
Let them enjoy this beautiful bright festival!
Is there anyone who is a grateful servant?
Let them rejoice and enter into the joy of their Lord!

Are there any weary with fasting? 
Let them now receive their wages!
If any have toiled from the first hour, 
let them receive their due reward;
If any have come after the third hour, 
let him with gratitude join in the Feast!
And he that arrived after the sixth hour, 
let him not doubt; for he too shall sustain no loss.
And if any delayed until the ninth hour, 
let him not hesitate; but let him come too.
And he who arrived only at the eleventh hour, 
let him not be afraid by reason of his delay.

For the Lord is gracious and receives the last even as the first.
He gives rest to him that comes at the eleventh hour, 
as well as to him that toiled from the first.
To this one He gives, and upon another He bestows.
He accepts the works as He greets the endeavor.
The deed He honors and the intention He commends.

Let us all enter into the joy of the Lord! 
First and last alike receive your reward; 
rich and poor, rejoice together!
Sober and slothful, celebrate the day!

You that have kept the fast, and you that have not, 
rejoice today for the Table is richly laden!
Feast royally on it, the calf is a fatted one.
Let no one go away hungry. Partake, all, of the cup of faith.
Enjoy all the riches of His goodness!

Let no one grieve at his poverty, 
for the universal kingdom has been revealed.
Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; 
for forgiveness has risen from the grave.
Let no one fear death, for the Death of our Savior has set us free.
He has destroyed it by enduring it.

He destroyed Hades when He descended into it.
He put it into an uproar even as it tasted of His flesh.
Isaiah foretold this when he said,
&quot;You, O Hell, have been troubled by encountering Him below.&quot;

Hell was in an uproar because it was done away with.
It was in an uproar because it is mocked.
It was in an uproar, for it is destroyed.
It is in an uproar, for it is annihilated.
It is in an uproar, for it is now made captive.
Hell took a body, and discovered God. 
It took earth, and encountered Heaven.
It took what it saw, and was overcome by what it did not see.
O death, where is thy sting?
O Hades, where is thy victory?

Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!
Christ is Risen, and the evil ones are cast down!
Christ is Risen, and the angels rejoice!
Christ is Risen, and life is liberated!
Christ is Risen, and the tomb is emptied of its dead;
for Christ having risen from the dead,
is become the first-fruits of those who have fallen asleep.

To Him be Glory and Power forever and ever. Amen!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What a wonderful post! Steve, the Orthodox/Armenian/Wesleyan types among us would express it identically.</p>
<p>St. John Chrysostom&#8217;s Easter sermon says things very close to what iMonk has said:</p>
<p>&#8220;Is there anyone who is a devout lover of God?<br />
Let them enjoy this beautiful bright festival!<br />
Is there anyone who is a grateful servant?<br />
Let them rejoice and enter into the joy of their Lord!</p>
<p>Are there any weary with fasting?<br />
Let them now receive their wages!<br />
If any have toiled from the first hour,<br />
let them receive their due reward;<br />
If any have come after the third hour,<br />
let him with gratitude join in the Feast!<br />
And he that arrived after the sixth hour,<br />
let him not doubt; for he too shall sustain no loss.<br />
And if any delayed until the ninth hour,<br />
let him not hesitate; but let him come too.<br />
And he who arrived only at the eleventh hour,<br />
let him not be afraid by reason of his delay.</p>
<p>For the Lord is gracious and receives the last even as the first.<br />
He gives rest to him that comes at the eleventh hour,<br />
as well as to him that toiled from the first.<br />
To this one He gives, and upon another He bestows.<br />
He accepts the works as He greets the endeavor.<br />
The deed He honors and the intention He commends.</p>
<p>Let us all enter into the joy of the Lord!<br />
First and last alike receive your reward;<br />
rich and poor, rejoice together!<br />
Sober and slothful, celebrate the day!</p>
<p>You that have kept the fast, and you that have not,<br />
rejoice today for the Table is richly laden!<br />
Feast royally on it, the calf is a fatted one.<br />
Let no one go away hungry. Partake, all, of the cup of faith.<br />
Enjoy all the riches of His goodness!</p>
<p>Let no one grieve at his poverty,<br />
for the universal kingdom has been revealed.<br />
Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again;<br />
for forgiveness has risen from the grave.<br />
Let no one fear death, for the Death of our Savior has set us free.<br />
He has destroyed it by enduring it.</p>
<p>He destroyed Hades when He descended into it.<br />
He put it into an uproar even as it tasted of His flesh.<br />
Isaiah foretold this when he said,<br />
&#8220;You, O Hell, have been troubled by encountering Him below.&#8221;</p>
<p>Hell was in an uproar because it was done away with.<br />
It was in an uproar because it is mocked.<br />
It was in an uproar, for it is destroyed.<br />
It is in an uproar, for it is annihilated.<br />
It is in an uproar, for it is now made captive.<br />
Hell took a body, and discovered God.<br />
It took earth, and encountered Heaven.<br />
It took what it saw, and was overcome by what it did not see.<br />
O death, where is thy sting?<br />
O Hades, where is thy victory?</p>
<p>Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!<br />
Christ is Risen, and the evil ones are cast down!<br />
Christ is Risen, and the angels rejoice!<br />
Christ is Risen, and life is liberated!<br />
Christ is Risen, and the tomb is emptied of its dead;<br />
for Christ having risen from the dead,<br />
is become the first-fruits of those who have fallen asleep.</p>
<p>To Him be Glory and Power forever and ever. Amen!</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337271</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:52:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337271</guid>
		<description>I agree with the comments of Dave R.  I was in my church&#039;s Christmas production, and though I would have liked to have stopped at the birth and just wallowed in that majesty and wonderment, my church likes to get the rest of the story and go all the way through the Resurrection.  Anyhow, we sang a song called &quot;Jesus Saves&quot;, and after repeating the phrase &quot;Jesus Saves&quot; about 50 times, and mulling over that truth, and watching Jesus restore a distraught Peter who had betrayed him, I was overwhelmed by the GRACE that God continues to extend to me and to all of us.  And I cried tears of JOY every time I sang that song.

Praise God that when we were YET sinners, Jesus died for us.  And although we are STILL sinners, Jesus died for us and forgives and restores.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with the comments of Dave R.  I was in my church&#8217;s Christmas production, and though I would have liked to have stopped at the birth and just wallowed in that majesty and wonderment, my church likes to get the rest of the story and go all the way through the Resurrection.  Anyhow, we sang a song called &#8220;Jesus Saves&#8221;, and after repeating the phrase &#8220;Jesus Saves&#8221; about 50 times, and mulling over that truth, and watching Jesus restore a distraught Peter who had betrayed him, I was overwhelmed by the GRACE that God continues to extend to me and to all of us.  And I cried tears of JOY every time I sang that song.</p>
<p>Praise God that when we were YET sinners, Jesus died for us.  And although we are STILL sinners, Jesus died for us and forgives and restores.</p>
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		<title>By: treebeard</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337175</link>
		<dc:creator>treebeard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 19:57:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337175</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a good one, Patrick.
I guess it&#039;s more fun to comment on what a jerk that guy Osteen is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a good one, Patrick.<br />
I guess it&#8217;s more fun to comment on what a jerk that guy Osteen is.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337150</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 19:31:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337150</guid>
		<description>Thank you for this reminder that Jesus came to give us an abundant life, one that is filled with joy because of the Father&#039;s grace and love. This is especially true this time of year when we see others, even those who claim to follow Christ, trying to fill their lives with a false joy and happiness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for this reminder that Jesus came to give us an abundant life, one that is filled with joy because of the Father&#8217;s grace and love. This is especially true this time of year when we see others, even those who claim to follow Christ, trying to fill their lives with a false joy and happiness.</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick Lynch</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337071</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Lynch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 17:40:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337071</guid>
		<description>Joy: the least popular comment thread on Internet Monk in recent memory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joy: the least popular comment thread on Internet Monk in recent memory.</p>
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		<title>By: treebeard</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/the-unlikely-command-of-holy-joy/comment-page-1#comment-337000</link>
		<dc:creator>treebeard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 16:13:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2654#comment-337000</guid>
		<description>Thank you, iMonk.

As an aside, I felt tremendous joy recently listening to &quot;For Unto Us a Child is Born&quot; from Handel&#039;s Messiah. The typical gloom in my life disappeared, at least for a time.

For those who need some joy: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UpHs7LFIsA</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, iMonk.</p>
<p>As an aside, I felt tremendous joy recently listening to &#8220;For Unto Us a Child is Born&#8221; from Handel&#8217;s Messiah. The typical gloom in my life disappeared, at least for a time.</p>
<p>For those who need some joy:<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UpHs7LFIsA" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UpHs7LFIsA</a></p>
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