Comments on: The Evangelical Liturgy 19: The Pastoral Prayer

By: wretchedsoul

wretchedsoul — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 22:39:21 +0000

People trust me when I say…We can never address Him by His Names enough…I do think that there are many other names/attributes that God can be addressed by that are never used; which would eliminate the redundancy. As far as saying “We just…” I understand it to be used as a form of humility. I don’t use it as much as others because I believe that when we are praying for those things that God has said he will we are to stand “boldly” before His throne and make our request.

By: rysch

rysch — Fri, 30 Oct 2009 04:24:36 +0000

Lucy’s “We just ask you Lord” reflection reminded me of the value of pastoral prayers, particularly ones that are liturgical in nature and “pre-arranged” (for lack of a better word).

Am I the only one that gets absolutely driven nuts by the 100s times people say the word “just” in their prayers? “Lord we just ask…we just want to…we just…we just…we just…”

That and when every other word is “God” or “Father” or “Jesus.” I mean, the guy upstairs knows his name and doesn’t have amnesia. Cm’on people. Hence, I like liturgical prayers (with the extemporaneous added for good measure I might add)

By: cjones

cjones — Thu, 29 Oct 2009 13:16:06 +0000

A “drag on worship”? Really? This makes me wonder who, exactly is being worshipped – the congregation or God?

It is way easier to talk about prayer, take prayer requests, even teach and preach about prayer, than actually pray. Prayer encounters God Himself on His terms, not ours. It is humbling, and therefore out of the contemporary comfort zone.

My prayer life has grown by leaps and bounds by hearing others pray – especially my pastors and teachers. Prayer, for me, is where real engagement with God happens. It is the best, most spiritually active part of corporate worship. But, I agree, it doesn’t make good theater.

By: Boaz

Boaz — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 09:23:23 +0000

“Most of the time, Iâ€™d prefer to simply pray the Lordâ€™s Prayer, but Iâ€™m not sure how people would take it. ”

How on earth could anybody have a problem with a prayer following Christ’s specific, explicit instruction?

By: Don Johnson

Don Johnson — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 13:34:17 +0000

One of my pastors does a very good job as such prayers and I have learned a lot from his prayers.

P.S. Thanks for not deleting Molly’s post.

By: RonP

RonP — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 08:04:28 +0000

As the informal, untitled leader of a simple/home church fellowship, I rarely engage in what you would call solo pastoral prayer. Almost all of our praying together is of the open and participatory variety. But I do often start the praying and conclude it — so, in that respect, I try to set an example of focusing my thoughts on God and praying genuinely from the heart with the aim that we all enter into intensive, worshipful prayer together. And I think most people can tell the difference between when a pastor or leader is merely reciting a well-crafted prayer and when he’s really entering into heart-felt, God-focused prayer himself — which I think naturally invites others to do the same, rather than just letting their thoughts wander until someone says “amen.”

By: Lucy

Lucy — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 06:00:12 +0000

I know we’re talking about church services and pastoral leading, but I wonder about other gatherings, too. I grew up praying the “Lord, we just ask…” type of thing. Now, as a liturgical Christian, I have access to other prayers. I lead a moms’ group and am often opening and closing our time with prayer. I have to admit, this is a struggle (not a huge one, but it’s something I think about, nonetheless). I do often write out my prayers, if only so that I’m not repetitive and don’t say “um” too much. Most of the time, I’d prefer to simply pray the Lord’s Prayer, but I’m not sure how people would take it. (Everyone in the group is a Christian, but I am the only non-evangelical.) The fact that I’m concerned that praying the Lord’s Prayer might be off-putting and somehow not meaningful enough probably says a lot. It’s not that I never say spontaneous prayers, but that has become a much more private form of prayer for me. After many years of saying the same prayers over and over both in personal and in corporate prayer, they mean so much more to me than my own pathetic words because they remind of me of truth and direct my attention away from my feelings. I’d even be ok writing out prayers for opening and closing and simply praying the same things every week. Yes, I’m a creature of habit. Hey, I didn’t join a church that does the same thing every week for no reason!

I guess I’m trying to say that I totally agree with you and think that public prayer is different from private prayer, especially when it comes from a leader and I think that pastors who understand this perform a great service to their congregations.

By: molly

molly — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 02:35:06 +0000

Thanks, IM. I hesitated to put my comment out…and am sorry to have veered the topic off track. It would not have offended me if you would have removed my comment (hey—your blog, your rules)…but at the same time, I appreciate you leaving it out there. I recognize that this will simply remain an area of disagreement. Such is life. I appreciate your willingness to listen, all the same.

By: wezlo

wezlo — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 01:34:19 +0000

I typically do it REAL simple – “Hi folks let’s share joys and concerns and we’ll do this refrain because we’re all called to pray as a people.”

Ideally, it would be a guided prayer, covering not just the stuff that’s near us, but also things that are beyond personal concerns. There is a LOT of wisdom in this type of guided prayer, and I try to take a season every year to get people used to it. Eventually, the guided prayer will be what we do all the time.

By: DSY

DSY — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 01:23:10 +0000

Molly, I posted my little note on Wilson’s below before I saw your note, sorry. While I cannot feel all that you experienced, I can most certainly follow it. I have read lots of Wilson over the years and even benefited quite a bit from it, like you say, the good stuff. I actually think that Wilson and the leaders at his church would have come down very hard on the one who treated you so badly, but this takes nothing away from the way he took this teaching and applied it poorly. Still, it may be that more emphasis from Wilson on gentle, sacrificial, nourishing love from a husband to his wife would be helpful. I know its in there, but you would have been helped if it were highlighted more. Hang in there.