http://books.google.com/books?id=SmBx2fVWLAQC&lpg=PA1&dq=don't%20waste%20your%20life&pg=PA1#v=onepage&q=&f=false

“The rapid decline in the continent’s church attendance over the past 40 years may have done Europe a favor. It has freed churches of trying to operate as national entities that attempt to serve all members of society. Today, no church stands a realistic chance of incorporating everyone. Smaller, more focused bodies, however, can be more passionate, enthusiastic, and rigorously committed to personal holiness. ” – Philip Jenkins ( http://www.foreignpolicy.com/story/cms.php?story_id=3881 )

Language is obviously an issue. It amazes me how Latin tied together very different cultures and ethnicities – well into the eighteenth century. No matter where you lived, the mass was in Latin – prior to the reformation. Letters between German-speaking Zinzendorf and English-speaking John Wesley were written in Latin. I don’t think that holds any answer for the future. I am not a proponent of any one-language-only politics, be it Latin or English. It may point to where the problem begain: ethicity and national identity being tied to a church as an unintended result of the reformation. It further degraded with church services being divided by generation and music. Are we now going to tell people that they can’t come to church and “have it your way”? It’s a long road back to focusing on one body, one Spirit, one hope, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. I think it is something worth exploring. I wonder if post-modernism might actually create a desire for places where all are invited – a place of grace.

I understand perfectly what you mean, and I’m not sure where you live, but I would imagine that most black/white church situations come from the same source and that being a hold over from another era. Again, I don’t think that is right. One of my biggest regrets is that when I was much younger I did not reach out as much nor encourage others to do so to my cousin who had just entered into a bi-racial marriage. It’s one thing I still feel shame for even though I was young then, only a teen, and it was more the failure of the adults in my family.

I do see a good bit more diversity developing along Asian/Hispanic/white lines than the black/white lines. I think, unfortuanely that will take longer, because the history there is more complicated as well, and I don’t want to sound stereotypical, but worship styles and music styles and even really church governance styles have developed differently in those groups and that acts as an artifical impediment as well.

But I like the “one Lord, one faith, one baptism” verse as I’m sure you do. I really do desire to see us all untied as I’m sure you do as well. And do forgive me for sounding defensive.

You can mod this conversation if you want to, but Christine your rant is typical of the overreaction and stereotyping that is directed at folks who disagree with the “forced diversity” propaganda

I’m saying this. It is wrong for folks like you and Pastor Rah to assume that just b/c a congregation is not culturaly diverse that they are somehow not living out the Great Commission or that they are likewise exclusive of others just because they are not diverse

Why are black churches, or Korean churches, or Hispanic Churches not criticized as well for not being diverse? Why just white churches?

If a church is in an area where there are few to no minorities then they are not being diverse, they are being exactly what their circumstances dictate. For a white congregation in a white area to force some sort of fake diversity by incorporating aspects of worship or elements of music or anything that are not relevant to the people actually present is just silly and intellectually dishonest

Let me repeat, and I despise that a person can not disagree about these issues without being labeled exclusive and having to defend themselves, but I practice real diversity, I pastor a rural white church that just welcomed in with open arms a neighboring black church for a special revival service, two weeks ago, I, despite the ire of many, had a young lady who is a member stand and introduce us to her new baby, which is our custom, despite the fact that 1) the child was illegitimate and 2) the child was bi-racial

I have another regular attendee who is a choctaw Indian, he just asked me if it would be okay to bring his black girlfriend to churhc, i said sure and if anyone looked at him funny that I would personally deal with it myself

I even have some Yankee transplants, they were toughest to accept:)

But for my pretty much exclusively white congregation to force some sense of diversity by sining spirituals or anything esle, would be as silly as the local AME church to start singing white convention shape note songs, or me to start wearing a black/green/red stole

that sort of showy diversity is not legitimate and is in a sense hypocritical, it is more substance than show