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	<title>Comments on: Just the Facts, Ma&#8217;am</title>
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	<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam</link>
	<description>...dispatches from the post-evangelical wilderness</description>
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		<title>By: Rob Lofland</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-386677</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Lofland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Mar 2009 22:44:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>sorry, the Bob Dylan Comment was for another post but you get the idea.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sorry, the Bob Dylan Comment was for another post but you get the idea.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob Lofland</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-386673</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Lofland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Mar 2009 22:40:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Have you read &quot;Chronicles Volume 1&quot; by Bob Dylan.
If you&#039;re interested in Bob Dylan it is excellent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Have you read &#8220;Chronicles Volume 1&#8243; by Bob Dylan.<br />
If you&#8217;re interested in Bob Dylan it is excellent.</p>
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		<title>By: austin</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381108</link>
		<dc:creator>austin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:36:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>JoanieD

It was the one Imonk mentioned in a blog a few pasts. 

It is called Arminian Theology

I got barnes and noble to order it

I read it in about a day and 1/2

It is a very good and easy read

I had always considered myself a pretty strong Calvinist. 

Turns out I&#039;m more of a classical Arminian, as are most of the baptist preachers I grew up listening to.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JoanieD</p>
<p>It was the one Imonk mentioned in a blog a few pasts. </p>
<p>It is called Arminian Theology</p>
<p>I got barnes and noble to order it</p>
<p>I read it in about a day and 1/2</p>
<p>It is a very good and easy read</p>
<p>I had always considered myself a pretty strong Calvinist. </p>
<p>Turns out I&#8217;m more of a classical Arminian, as are most of the baptist preachers I grew up listening to.</p>
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		<title>By: JoanieD</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381106</link>
		<dc:creator>JoanieD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:27:51 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Hey, thanks, Austin, for letting me know that Roger Olson believes infants &quot;go to heaven.&quot;  I guess maybe I can stay classified as an Arminian after all! I have only read some of the online things that Roger Olson has written.  I haven&#039;t read his books yet. There are just so many books out there that I would like to read. 

If Michael would not mind our getting off-topic a bit, which of Olson&#039;s books did you read and is it one you would recommend over other books of his if you have read his other books?  Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, thanks, Austin, for letting me know that Roger Olson believes infants &#8220;go to heaven.&#8221;  I guess maybe I can stay classified as an Arminian after all! I have only read some of the online things that Roger Olson has written.  I haven&#8217;t read his books yet. There are just so many books out there that I would like to read. </p>
<p>If Michael would not mind our getting off-topic a bit, which of Olson&#8217;s books did you read and is it one you would recommend over other books of his if you have read his other books?  Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: Martha</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381101</link>
		<dc:creator>Martha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 17:03:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2847#comment-381101</guid>
		<description>&quot;The evidence for WS being a convinced Protestant pretty much consists of Hamlet studying at Wittenberg.&quot;

And in the same play, Hamlet after seeing his father&#039;s ghost, invokes St. Patrick when talking to Horatio.  Why St. Patrick?  A Danish prince in an English play swearing by an Irish saint?

Because everyone would have associated St. Patrick with Purgatory (thanks to Lough Derg, where he was supposed to have found an entrance into the Underworld) and connected this invocation with the Ghost.

I am dubious about the more enthusiastic of my co-religionists enlisting Shakespeare as &quot;one of us&quot;; it reminds me too much of gay activists reeling off a long list of famous historical personages in the arts and sciences, claiming &quot;And they were gay, so that means we&#039;re better!&quot;

His parents certainly were of the generation that was Catholic; he grew up in those blurred, confusing times when the pendulum swung between reform and Reform, and the English church was swayed between those who wanted to import the Continental reform and pure Protestantism and those who wanted to keep a toe-hold for traditional Catholicism.  I think myself he was yet another &#039;bright country boy goes to big city, mixes in higher social circle than his home, becomes sophisticated and gives up all that old-tyme religion&#039; - whatever religion he may or may not have practiced.  A heritage of Catholic tradition in the back of his head, like so many others, which is why he could make the St. Patrick allusion with no need for heavy-handed explaining.  

Certainly I don&#039;t think Shakespeare was a flat-out atheist like Kit Marlowe, but I imagine him with a kind of cocked eyebrow of scepticism about all the changes being arbitrarily imposed according to who was riding high in the saddle of state power at the moment, and being very careful (like any prudent person growing up under the Tudors) not to say anything that could be construed as critical of the Monarch, whoever that might be at the moment, and whether he or she was Papist, Protestant, or in-between.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The evidence for WS being a convinced Protestant pretty much consists of Hamlet studying at Wittenberg.&#8221;</p>
<p>And in the same play, Hamlet after seeing his father&#8217;s ghost, invokes St. Patrick when talking to Horatio.  Why St. Patrick?  A Danish prince in an English play swearing by an Irish saint?</p>
<p>Because everyone would have associated St. Patrick with Purgatory (thanks to Lough Derg, where he was supposed to have found an entrance into the Underworld) and connected this invocation with the Ghost.</p>
<p>I am dubious about the more enthusiastic of my co-religionists enlisting Shakespeare as &#8220;one of us&#8221;; it reminds me too much of gay activists reeling off a long list of famous historical personages in the arts and sciences, claiming &#8220;And they were gay, so that means we&#8217;re better!&#8221;</p>
<p>His parents certainly were of the generation that was Catholic; he grew up in those blurred, confusing times when the pendulum swung between reform and Reform, and the English church was swayed between those who wanted to import the Continental reform and pure Protestantism and those who wanted to keep a toe-hold for traditional Catholicism.  I think myself he was yet another &#8216;bright country boy goes to big city, mixes in higher social circle than his home, becomes sophisticated and gives up all that old-tyme religion&#8217; &#8211; whatever religion he may or may not have practiced.  A heritage of Catholic tradition in the back of his head, like so many others, which is why he could make the St. Patrick allusion with no need for heavy-handed explaining.  </p>
<p>Certainly I don&#8217;t think Shakespeare was a flat-out atheist like Kit Marlowe, but I imagine him with a kind of cocked eyebrow of scepticism about all the changes being arbitrarily imposed according to who was riding high in the saddle of state power at the moment, and being very careful (like any prudent person growing up under the Tudors) not to say anything that could be construed as critical of the Monarch, whoever that might be at the moment, and whether he or she was Papist, Protestant, or in-between.</p>
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		<title>By: Bryan</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381097</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2847#comment-381097</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s good to know you Michael and am glad to see you at St. Patrick&#039;s each month.  We should do dinner sometime.

Pax.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s good to know you Michael and am glad to see you at St. Patrick&#8217;s each month.  We should do dinner sometime.</p>
<p>Pax.</p>
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		<title>By: austin</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381089</link>
		<dc:creator>austin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:50:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2847#comment-381089</guid>
		<description>JoanieD

I just finished reading Olson&#039;s book and my understanding is that he believes that infants go to heaven as well.  They do have original sin,but that original sin is sort of put on hold by God&#039;s grace until they reach and age of knowledge

hope that helps

Austin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JoanieD</p>
<p>I just finished reading Olson&#8217;s book and my understanding is that he believes that infants go to heaven as well.  They do have original sin,but that original sin is sort of put on hold by God&#8217;s grace until they reach and age of knowledge</p>
<p>hope that helps</p>
<p>Austin</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Eaton</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381080</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Eaton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:42:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/?p=2847#comment-381080</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s good to know you, brother (even if only through the blog and one meal together).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s good to know you, brother (even if only through the blog and one meal together).</p>
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		<title>By: wcwirla</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381073</link>
		<dc:creator>wcwirla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:33:46 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Great post, Michael.  It&#039;s a pleasure to know a bit about the host.  Thanks for hosting this marvelous conversation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post, Michael.  It&#8217;s a pleasure to know a bit about the host.  Thanks for hosting this marvelous conversation.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: matt stephens</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/just-the-facts-maam/comment-page-1#comment-381070</link>
		<dc:creator>matt stephens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:30:40 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>So good to meet other non-Calvinists who nonetheless appreciate and are influenced by many Calvinists, as well as the Reformation in general... while also not being forced into the Arminian camp.  Ironically, i&#039;m more or less a (disgruntled) Southern Baptist as well.  The flavor of SBC i grew up was considerably less Calvinistic than the current SBTS flavor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So good to meet other non-Calvinists who nonetheless appreciate and are influenced by many Calvinists, as well as the Reformation in general&#8230; while also not being forced into the Arminian camp.  Ironically, i&#8217;m more or less a (disgruntled) Southern Baptist as well.  The flavor of SBC i grew up was considerably less Calvinistic than the current SBTS flavor.</p>
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