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	<title>Comments on: Jesus Isn&#8217;t Cool: Chanon Ross Challenges Evangelical Youth Ministry</title>
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	<description>...dispatches from the post-evangelical wilderness</description>
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		<title>By: David Learn</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4755</link>
		<dc:creator>David Learn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Nov 2005 06:43:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4755</guid>
		<description>Fantastic article referenced. I&#039;ve already passed the link on to a friend of mine whom I had a discussion with on this very topic recently.

Essentially, a church in our area is using paintball as a form of outreach to the youth in the area. Now I&#039;m all for paintball, but I&#039;m not really sure how inviting everyone along for an evening of it counts as outreach in the traditional sense of the word. To the church&#039;s credit (?), the price of admission is listening to a sermon, but I suspect that most teens are going to see this as a bait-and-switch con and will be left unimpressed and uninterested in both the church and what it claims to offer.

My friend, who appeared to support the approach, which admittedly is a popular one, attributed it to the church&#039;s desire to minister to teens&#039; need to be entertained. (Personally, I wasn&#039;t aware that Gen Y and the Millennials were being castigated for excessive industry and seriousness, but I digress.) My own feeling is that the fields are ripe for harvest. Teens are looking for meaning, direction and guideposts -- not just of the moral sort, but of the spiritual variety as well -- and the church is uniquely positioned to bring them those things, if only we would remember the gospel we have been entrusted with, and rely on its power instead of the slick marketing techniques the world uses.

Delivering the gospel in a way that teens will understand and recognize, such as Bible study, thoughtful discussion of popular media and prevailing issues, and (of course) involving them in Christlike ministry to the needy, would seem to me the best way to reach them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantastic article referenced. I&#8217;ve already passed the link on to a friend of mine whom I had a discussion with on this very topic recently.</p>
<p>Essentially, a church in our area is using paintball as a form of outreach to the youth in the area. Now I&#8217;m all for paintball, but I&#8217;m not really sure how inviting everyone along for an evening of it counts as outreach in the traditional sense of the word. To the church&#8217;s credit (?), the price of admission is listening to a sermon, but I suspect that most teens are going to see this as a bait-and-switch con and will be left unimpressed and uninterested in both the church and what it claims to offer.</p>
<p>My friend, who appeared to support the approach, which admittedly is a popular one, attributed it to the church&#8217;s desire to minister to teens&#8217; need to be entertained. (Personally, I wasn&#8217;t aware that Gen Y and the Millennials were being castigated for excessive industry and seriousness, but I digress.) My own feeling is that the fields are ripe for harvest. Teens are looking for meaning, direction and guideposts &#8212; not just of the moral sort, but of the spiritual variety as well &#8212; and the church is uniquely positioned to bring them those things, if only we would remember the gospel we have been entrusted with, and rely on its power instead of the slick marketing techniques the world uses.</p>
<p>Delivering the gospel in a way that teens will understand and recognize, such as Bible study, thoughtful discussion of popular media and prevailing issues, and (of course) involving them in Christlike ministry to the needy, would seem to me the best way to reach them.</p>
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		<title>By: One Salient Oversight</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4066</link>
		<dc:creator>One Salient Oversight</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4066</guid>
		<description>In many ways Australia is waaaay ahead of what is going on in America.

Australia is a godless, secular society. Although there are substantial amounts of Born again Christians, most Aussies rarely go to church - we do not have a church going culture like America does.

I think America is in danger of becoming like Australia in the next 50 years in this area.

Anyway, back in the 1960s and 1970s evangelical churches had youth groups that followed the same principles that many American youth groups have today... fun, frivolity and a bit of the bible tacked on at the end.

As time progressed, however, it became clear that this style of youth work was not successful. Oh there were lots of happy kids that turned up each week to youth group, but very few of these kids went on to become regular church-goers and have any real form of Christian faith.

In reaction to this, a number of Evangelical ministers wrote a book called &quot;No Guts, No Glory&quot; where they argued strongly for a radical overhaul of popular youth ministry. Their argument was that youth groups should be committed to teaching the Word of God and preaching the gospel - even if the kids don&#039;t like it or want it!

Their argument made Biblical AND practical sense. By focusing upon teaching the word and preaching the gospel (along with silly games - though not  as many) there was a greater chance that young people would make a genuine commitment to Christ, and continue that commitment as they grew up.

The new paradigm also changed the role of youth worker. Gone were the young, fashionable youth workers with their motorbikes and music collections. Instead, young men and women from the church began to lead those younger than them. In many Sydney Anglican churches, youth group members who grew up became leaders of the youth group they left. In the place of the youth worker came a seminary-trained pastor who trained and pastored these leaders.

In addition to this, a week-long conference was held each year (The Katoomba Youth Leaders Training Conference) where young adults who were leading youth groups (or who had the potential to) were trained. This involved listening to two speakers every day expounding from the Old Testament and the New Testament, and daily seminars on hermeneutics, biblical theology and systematic theology. Very little time was spent on things like organising games.

I&#039;d love to say that the results of this have been spectacular, but it has not - at least not in a worldly, numerical sense. What it has achieved has been genuine commitment to Christ in youth groups in Anglican churches all over Sydney, as well as steadily growing adult attendances as these young people get older.

All I&#039;m saying is that Chanon Ross is on the right track. If you&#039;re involved in youth work, teach the word and preach the gospel - even if people prefer pizza and games.

No Guts no Glory (Matthias Media)
&lt;a href=&quot;http://secure.fellowworkers.com/cgi-bin/mmstore/ngng.html?id=jxb7efHh&quot;&gt;http://secure.fellowworkers.com/cgi-bin/mmstore/ngng.html?id=jxb7efHh&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In many ways Australia is waaaay ahead of what is going on in America.</p>
<p>Australia is a godless, secular society. Although there are substantial amounts of Born again Christians, most Aussies rarely go to church &#8211; we do not have a church going culture like America does.</p>
<p>I think America is in danger of becoming like Australia in the next 50 years in this area.</p>
<p>Anyway, back in the 1960s and 1970s evangelical churches had youth groups that followed the same principles that many American youth groups have today&#8230; fun, frivolity and a bit of the bible tacked on at the end.</p>
<p>As time progressed, however, it became clear that this style of youth work was not successful. Oh there were lots of happy kids that turned up each week to youth group, but very few of these kids went on to become regular church-goers and have any real form of Christian faith.</p>
<p>In reaction to this, a number of Evangelical ministers wrote a book called &#8220;No Guts, No Glory&#8221; where they argued strongly for a radical overhaul of popular youth ministry. Their argument was that youth groups should be committed to teaching the Word of God and preaching the gospel &#8211; even if the kids don&#8217;t like it or want it!</p>
<p>Their argument made Biblical AND practical sense. By focusing upon teaching the word and preaching the gospel (along with silly games &#8211; though not  as many) there was a greater chance that young people would make a genuine commitment to Christ, and continue that commitment as they grew up.</p>
<p>The new paradigm also changed the role of youth worker. Gone were the young, fashionable youth workers with their motorbikes and music collections. Instead, young men and women from the church began to lead those younger than them. In many Sydney Anglican churches, youth group members who grew up became leaders of the youth group they left. In the place of the youth worker came a seminary-trained pastor who trained and pastored these leaders.</p>
<p>In addition to this, a week-long conference was held each year (The Katoomba Youth Leaders Training Conference) where young adults who were leading youth groups (or who had the potential to) were trained. This involved listening to two speakers every day expounding from the Old Testament and the New Testament, and daily seminars on hermeneutics, biblical theology and systematic theology. Very little time was spent on things like organising games.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d love to say that the results of this have been spectacular, but it has not &#8211; at least not in a worldly, numerical sense. What it has achieved has been genuine commitment to Christ in youth groups in Anglican churches all over Sydney, as well as steadily growing adult attendances as these young people get older.</p>
<p>All I&#8217;m saying is that Chanon Ross is on the right track. If you&#8217;re involved in youth work, teach the word and preach the gospel &#8211; even if people prefer pizza and games.</p>
<p>No Guts no Glory (Matthias Media)<br />
<a href="http://secure.fellowworkers.com/cgi-bin/mmstore/ngng.html?id=jxb7efHh">http://secure.fellowworkers.com/cgi-bin/mmstore/ngng.html?id=jxb7efHh</a></p>
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		<title>By: Konrad</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4067</link>
		<dc:creator>Konrad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4067</guid>
		<description>A friend of mine once put it this way.

&quot;Christianity isn&#039;t supposed to be fun. One of the reason I left [my old church] is because people would go around and say how fun youth group was. I&#039;m not against having fun, but we can&#039;t compete with the world in terms of fun. Frat parties and raves will always be more fun than anything Christian youth groups can make. We have to preach the gospel of Jesus, not this &#039;everyone is happy&#039; variety.&quot;

And that&#039;s totally right. When people raised Christian turn 12 or so, they start thinking for themselves and questioning the facts they were brought up under. It&#039;s the parents&#039; and the church&#039;s job to give solid teaching that helps people through high school and into college with a solid Biblical foundation...

Or think of it this way...do you want college freshmen to be looking for fun or looking for Christ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A friend of mine once put it this way.</p>
<p>&#8220;Christianity isn&#8217;t supposed to be fun. One of the reason I left [my old church] is because people would go around and say how fun youth group was. I&#8217;m not against having fun, but we can&#8217;t compete with the world in terms of fun. Frat parties and raves will always be more fun than anything Christian youth groups can make. We have to preach the gospel of Jesus, not this &#8216;everyone is happy&#8217; variety.&#8221;</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s totally right. When people raised Christian turn 12 or so, they start thinking for themselves and questioning the facts they were brought up under. It&#8217;s the parents&#8217; and the church&#8217;s job to give solid teaching that helps people through high school and into college with a solid Biblical foundation&#8230;</p>
<p>Or think of it this way&#8230;do you want college freshmen to be looking for fun or looking for Christ?</p>
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		<title>By: Kellywatchthestars</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4068</link>
		<dc:creator>Kellywatchthestars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4068</guid>
		<description>Awwww your blog was a pleasant breath of fresh air.. Well done, I will visit as often as I can.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Awwww your blog was a pleasant breath of fresh air.. Well done, I will visit as often as I can.</p>
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		<title>By: Amy</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4069</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4069</guid>
		<description>I have thought and this is only my opinion that some folks in Texas who grew up in High school with Young Life/K-Life type groups now want these types of services in churches as adults and this is why my old church always felt like a YL meeting for adults all the time (and actually the pastor started out as a YL Leader and youth pastor)IT would start with announcements, have a cute skit, sing some raucus songs with GOd in the title, sing a slow song to get in the mood, hear a sermon that made us laugh, and go home feeling like you could win the HS Football game if Jesus was on your side.Some never got past the entertainment venue Christianity and want that same feeling every Sunday that they got in High School on Monday nights.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have thought and this is only my opinion that some folks in Texas who grew up in High school with Young Life/K-Life type groups now want these types of services in churches as adults and this is why my old church always felt like a YL meeting for adults all the time (and actually the pastor started out as a YL Leader and youth pastor)IT would start with announcements, have a cute skit, sing some raucus songs with GOd in the title, sing a slow song to get in the mood, hear a sermon that made us laugh, and go home feeling like you could win the HS Football game if Jesus was on your side.Some never got past the entertainment venue Christianity and want that same feeling every Sunday that they got in High School on Monday nights.</p>
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		<title>By: graham</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4070</link>
		<dc:creator>graham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4070</guid>
		<description>Michael, I&#039;m not sure if I agree or disagree.

Isn&#039;t part of this about teaching styles? You don&#039;t teach pre-teens the same way you teach folk at Uni. Making it &quot;fun&quot; might not be watering anything down, it might just be good practice. 

However, I think you&#039;re onto something here:

&quot;With only a few exceptions, they talk only about God and never about Jesus and the Gospel. The problems the Gospel addresses are not problems that concern them.&quot;

And, I&#039;d want to add, the same could be said of many of our adults. The problem, at the end of the day, is not how they&#039;re taught, but what they are taught.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael, I&#8217;m not sure if I agree or disagree.</p>
<p>Isn&#8217;t part of this about teaching styles? You don&#8217;t teach pre-teens the same way you teach folk at Uni. Making it &#8220;fun&#8221; might not be watering anything down, it might just be good practice. </p>
<p>However, I think you&#8217;re onto something here:</p>
<p>&#8220;With only a few exceptions, they talk only about God and never about Jesus and the Gospel. The problems the Gospel addresses are not problems that concern them.&#8221;</p>
<p>And, I&#8217;d want to add, the same could be said of many of our adults. The problem, at the end of the day, is not how they&#8217;re taught, but what they are taught.</p>
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		<title>By: Charis</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4071</link>
		<dc:creator>Charis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4071</guid>
		<description>How can we expect the youth of the church to be educated, ie, discipled, when there is little of discipleship within the congregation... I still recall that after&quot;walking down the aisle&quot; at the age of 10, perhaps the only Christian education I received over the next five years was basically how to make a shoe-shine kit, and other such nonsence.
If I were still active within Church and not living this hermit-monk existence, I would stongly recommend an indepth study of Oswald Chambers in conjunction with the gospels...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How can we expect the youth of the church to be educated, ie, discipled, when there is little of discipleship within the congregation&#8230; I still recall that after&#8221;walking down the aisle&#8221; at the age of 10, perhaps the only Christian education I received over the next five years was basically how to make a shoe-shine kit, and other such nonsence.<br />
If I were still active within Church and not living this hermit-monk existence, I would stongly recommend an indepth study of Oswald Chambers in conjunction with the gospels&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Ken boyd</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4072</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken boyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4072</guid>
		<description>Michael &amp; IM readers:  What are your thoughts on most youth group skits?  Most depict JESUS as a helpless individual either longing for some teenager to &quot;love and accept HIM&quot; or in a really brutal fight against satan.

On Wed. night at our community&#039;s See You AFTER the Pole, a local church&#039;s youth drama team did a skit to the song, &quot;This is the air I breathe&quot;, ... and depicted JESUS as the one singing to the other skit participants !!  Can you imagine The KING of KINGS and the LORD of Lords saying, 

&quot;And I I&#039;m desperate for you
And I I&#039;m I&#039;m lost without you&quot; 

That&#039;s what I saw depicted a couple of nights ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael &#038; IM readers:  What are your thoughts on most youth group skits?  Most depict JESUS as a helpless individual either longing for some teenager to &#8220;love and accept HIM&#8221; or in a really brutal fight against satan.</p>
<p>On Wed. night at our community&#8217;s See You AFTER the Pole, a local church&#8217;s youth drama team did a skit to the song, &#8220;This is the air I breathe&#8221;, &#8230; and depicted JESUS as the one singing to the other skit participants !!  Can you imagine The KING of KINGS and the LORD of Lords saying, </p>
<p>&#8220;And I I&#8217;m desperate for you<br />
And I I&#8217;m I&#8217;m lost without you&#8221; </p>
<p>That&#8217;s what I saw depicted a couple of nights ago.</p>
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		<title>By: Josh W.</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4073</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh W.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4073</guid>
		<description>&quot;That&#039;s what I saw depicted a couple of nights ago.&quot;

That&#039;s just... sad.  I&#039;m just glad to know that there are other Christians out there who are sick of the &quot;God is my girlfriend&quot; theology and the overemphasis on church being fun and entertaining.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;That&#8217;s what I saw depicted a couple of nights ago.&#8221;</p>
<p>That&#8217;s just&#8230; sad.  I&#8217;m just glad to know that there are other Christians out there who are sick of the &#8220;God is my girlfriend&#8221; theology and the overemphasis on church being fun and entertaining.</p>
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		<title>By: KT</title>
		<link>http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/jesus-isnt-cool-chanon-ross-challenges-evangelical-youth-ministry/comment-page-1#comment-4074</link>
		<dc:creator>KT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 19:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.internetmonk.com/im.php/?p=194#comment-4074</guid>
		<description>You know the perfect example Ive seen of this  is large Christian events like Spirit West Coast or Creationfest. Its funny I realized as a youth worker a long time ago that we are filling our kids with the values of this world rather than showing them what it means to follow Jesus. This is an overentertained culture anyways, most of the kids today go home to their X box or PS2&#039;s and Satellite TV deluging them with 200 channels of entertainment. It should be the job of a youth minister to teach them the values of Christ, worship,community,faith,love,grace and caring for the least of these.We should be showing them that Jesus Christ is real.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know the perfect example Ive seen of this  is large Christian events like Spirit West Coast or Creationfest. Its funny I realized as a youth worker a long time ago that we are filling our kids with the values of this world rather than showing them what it means to follow Jesus. This is an overentertained culture anyways, most of the kids today go home to their X box or PS2&#8217;s and Satellite TV deluging them with 200 channels of entertainment. It should be the job of a youth minister to teach them the values of Christ, worship,community,faith,love,grace and caring for the least of these.We should be showing them that Jesus Christ is real.</p>
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