I am not happy.

If they jumped ship TO us, we might

Jumping ship FROM us, well – we owe the Episcopalians a whole heap of favours for taking some of our flakier guys (like Matthew Fox, God love him, after the Dominicans handed him his sandwiches wrapped in a road map)

As you could tell from the comments above, our RC friends wouldn’t consider someone jumbing ship to the RCC and denying a great deal of what they are obligated to believe as their “brightest and best,” much as I wouldn’t use those words easily about a convert to the RCC from evangelicalism. (Though some appear to be at the time (Beckwith, Neuhaus) but that’s an issue with Protestantism’s incompleteness.)

Are you UCC or UMC? It must be one of the two. In neither is doctrine much of an issue.

ms

Also, it’s not like this discipline is hidden from anyone. Priests go through 6-10 years of formation before taking their vows – plenty of time to determine if you have what it takes. If not, do something else. No shame in that. The church needs devout men in all kinds of other roles.

Even after ordination it is possible for a priest to be released from the clerical state, marry a woman and remain a Catholic in good standing. That’s what Fr. Cutie should have done. The fact that he didn’t tells us that celibacy is not his only issue.

“When Father Cutié met with me on May 5th, he requested and I granted a leave of absence from the exercise of the priesthood. Because of this, he could no longer be the administrator of St Francis de Sales Parish or the General Director of Radio Paz. For the good of the Church and to avoid the media frenzy, I chose not to impose publicly an ecclesiastical penalty, although his admitted actions clearly warranted it. Since that meeting, I have not heard from Father Cutié nor has he requested to meet with me. He has never told me that he was considering joining the Episcopal Church.”

Lot more going on here than just “I wanna get married.” Lot of deception and not telling things straight.

But let’s face it, going into this, he knew what the score was. Same way getting married, you know that having a honey on the side is not allowed.

Five or ten years down the line, the spark is gone, and this really hot cutie moves in next door – sorry, still not on.

Now, if he had waited to be laicised and then married, there wouldn’t be the same amount of snargling over this. But apparently – *if* the Episcopalians can be believed – he’s been in ‘discernment’ to join them for two years?! And he never told anyone like, for instance, *his own bishop* about this??!! Until the beach photos came out????!!!

And then the next thing anyone hears of all this is “Hey, I’m Episcopalian now! And so is my girlfriend! And they made me a deacon! And we’ll probably get married! And I’ll be a priest!”

Plus there’s a lot more here than just “I want to get married but I’ll still believe exactly the same as I did before.” If he’s joining the Episcopalians, he is going to have to change, or already has changed, his mind on more than just married clergy.

You seem to be taking the tack that if only we stubborn RCs would just change this one tiny little thing, we’d be flooded with guys wanting to be ordained. Funny, that’s the same argument the women priest movement makes: if only we changed this one tiny little detail, we’d be flooded with potential ordinands.

And the same if we just changed this one tiny little detail about divorce. And contraception. And abortion. And the requirements for same-sex attracted people to live chastely.

That’s a lot of “just change this one little tiny details” stacking up there.

How about if you Baptists change this one tiny little detail about paedobaptism?

I’m going to be a real female dog here, but what’s your opinion on Jim McGreevey? Former Governor of New Jersey, resigned over scandal, came out as “I am a gay American and that’s why I’m being persecuted”, went through messy divorce and custody battle with his (second) wife, now has a male partner – and coincidentally, is now an Episcopalian also pursuing a course of study in General Theological Seminary, perhaps to become an Episcopalian priest.

Should we also have changed our one tiny little detail to allow him to remain RC and pursue the ordained ministry, which he obviously seems to have a vocation for? Imagine all the similar vocations out there just waiting for us to do so!

I think I was clear, except to Catholics

My whole point was a western priest knows that a) converts and 2) most eastern rite don’t have to make this vow.

That, to me, is the largest part of the problem in looking at why some priests try and fail at celibacy.

peace

ms

p.s. You are on report, buddy.