Comments on: The Baptist Way: A Hopeful Look Forward to Reformation/Renewal in the Southern Baptist Convention http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention ...dispatches from the post-evangelical wilderness Sun, 12 Feb 2012 07:36:12 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Bene D http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99981 Bene D Fri, 15 Jun 2007 22:53:27 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99981 More bloggers who have been politically involved with the SBC the past couple of years and got media attention are walking away from the politics and acknowledging reigning SBC power brokers can keep their power. This stepping back appears to be pre-planned and shows some spiritual discipline. These guys haven't appeared to be as mean-spirited and hard-headed as the long standing and groomed leadership. Alan at DownshoreDrift Ben Cole, Baptist Blogger Wade Burleson, Grace and Truth to You Robert Parham's article makes the most sense to this outsider - old guard fundamentalists/new guard fundamentalists. http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070615/OPINION01/706150402/1007/OPINION More bloggers who have been politically involved with the SBC the past couple of years and got media attention are walking away from the politics and acknowledging reigning SBC power brokers can keep their power.
This stepping back appears to be pre-planned and shows some spiritual discipline. These guys haven’t appeared to be as mean-spirited and hard-headed as the long standing and groomed leadership.

Alan at DownshoreDrift
Ben Cole, Baptist Blogger
Wade Burleson, Grace and Truth to You

Robert Parham’s article makes the most sense to this outsider – old guard fundamentalists/new guard fundamentalists.

http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070615/OPINION01/706150402/1007/OPINION

]]> By: Andrew http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99944 Andrew Fri, 15 Jun 2007 22:01:47 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99944 One way we can revitalize our Baptist churches is simply to obey Scripture! We need to start teaching people the truth and instructing them to teach it to still others (II Timothy 2:2). Not to get too programmatic, but it has been shown that ONE PERSON could evangelize the whole world by teaching each convert for SIX MONTHS the essentials of the faith and how to evangelize: He would disciple directly no more than 30 people at a time and it could be accomplished in 20 years! I have no problem with the SBC's fight for doctrine, but perhpas we could have accomplished the same goal in the same time with less drama! One way we can revitalize our Baptist churches is simply to obey Scripture! We need to start teaching people the truth and instructing them to teach it to still others (II Timothy 2:2). Not to get too programmatic, but it has been shown that ONE PERSON could evangelize the whole world by teaching each convert for SIX MONTHS the essentials of the faith and how to evangelize: He would disciple directly no more than 30 people at a time and it could be accomplished in 20 years! I have no problem with the SBC’s fight for doctrine, but perhpas we could have accomplished the same goal in the same time with less drama!

]]> By: brad brisco http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99836 brad brisco Fri, 15 Jun 2007 18:40:15 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99836 As one who is a part of the "missionary agencies" I too am optimistic, in a largely jaded kind of way. As one who is a part of the “missionary agencies” I too am optimistic, in a largely jaded kind of way.

]]> By: UberGoober http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99761 UberGoober Fri, 15 Jun 2007 16:48:04 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99761 The PCA this week decided to call the New Perspective on Paul and the Federal Vision, for all intents and purposes, heresy (it isn't the finding but the process and demeanor that is troubling). The SBC decided, essentially, to do nothing at all. I'm not sure which is worse. One thing seems clear: both denominations, which are equipped and capable of doing great things, are in deep kimchee. I am extremely optimistic about God's purposes in the world. I am deeply pessimistic about the SBC and the PCA figuring prominantly in said purposes. I'm still Southern Baptist, but the thinking part of me is wondering why. The PCA this week decided to call the New Perspective on Paul and the Federal Vision, for all intents and purposes, heresy (it isn’t the finding but the process and demeanor that is troubling). The SBC decided, essentially, to do nothing at all. I’m not sure which is worse.

One thing seems clear: both denominations, which are equipped and capable of doing great things, are in deep kimchee.

I am extremely optimistic about God’s purposes in the world. I am deeply pessimistic about the SBC and the PCA figuring prominantly in said purposes.

I’m still Southern Baptist, but the thinking part of me is wondering why.

]]> By: GL http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99724 GL Fri, 15 Jun 2007 15:50:56 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99724 You keep hitting it, Michael. Remarkable sense for what has happened, what is happening, and what is likely to occur in the years ahead. The sociologist in me wants to see more data, but your "sense" for things in the SBC resonates with my own. One observation you make makes me wonder about the future of the SBC-- the informal and sometimes formal networking with leaders, churches and resources outside the SBC. The evangelical world is awash in materials, but a good portion of that material seems to be from pastors and churches that have been blessed by God with some degree of "figuring it out" in their local context. While there may be too much pragmatism driving things, young and not-so-young SBC pastors can find in these networks much of what they need. They don't need the SBC for resources. Thom Rainer and Ed Stetzer are exceptions. I agree that any turn towards the mega-church model is not the best way forward. Especially as urban cores repopulate and densify, the suburban mega-model will not be a dire need like a urban churches will be. As commercial real estate prices continue to increase in urban cores, the re-populating and densifying cores will need churches not based on mammoth facilities. So much more to think about and discuss, but I appreciate your insight into the SBC. Keep it up! You keep hitting it, Michael. Remarkable sense for what has happened, what is happening, and what is likely to occur in the years ahead. The sociologist in me wants to see more data, but your “sense” for things in the SBC resonates with my own.

One observation you make makes me wonder about the future of the SBC– the informal and sometimes formal networking with leaders, churches and resources outside the SBC. The evangelical world is awash in materials, but a good portion of that material seems to be from pastors and churches that have been blessed by God with some degree of “figuring it out” in their local context. While there may be too much pragmatism driving things, young and not-so-young SBC pastors can find in these networks much of what they need. They don’t need the SBC for resources. Thom Rainer and Ed Stetzer are exceptions.

I agree that any turn towards the mega-church model is not the best way forward. Especially as urban cores repopulate and densify, the suburban mega-model will not be a dire need like a urban churches will be. As commercial real estate prices continue to increase in urban cores, the re-populating and densifying cores will need churches not based on mammoth facilities.

So much more to think about and discuss, but I appreciate your insight into the SBC. Keep it up!

]]> By: Ted http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99600 Ted Fri, 15 Jun 2007 12:02:29 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99600 Michael, A newsletter from the Mission America Coalition included a survey from Vision New England. I apologize for not being able to provide the hyperlink. These folk used a professional agency to discover what other suveys have shown. 71% of people attend a church service because a friend invited them. 86% came to faith in Christ over a period of time. Surely leaders will then ask the question, why do people not invite their friends to our church? Perhaps that is a place to begin. I suggest that when the people are being energized by the Holy Spirit as growing followers of Christ, they will invite their friends. When they are being bored, manipulated, etc. and there is in their mind an absence of the sense of the presence of the Lord, they will not invite their friends. What goes on in substance in a congregation is far more important than the programs on the tool bar. People often struggle with how to describe or where to isolate their disappointment, but they almost always stop inviting friends when those issues are present. Michael,

A newsletter from the Mission America Coalition included a survey from Vision New England. I apologize for not being able to provide the hyperlink.

These folk used a professional agency to discover what other suveys have shown. 71% of people attend a church service because a friend invited them. 86% came to faith in Christ over a period of time.

Surely leaders will then ask the question, why do people not invite their friends to our church? Perhaps that is a place to begin. I suggest that when the people are being energized by the Holy Spirit as growing followers of Christ, they will invite their friends. When they are being bored, manipulated, etc. and there is in their mind an absence of the sense of the presence of the Lord, they will not invite their friends.

What goes on in substance in a congregation is far more important than the programs on the tool bar.

People often struggle with how to describe or where to isolate their disappointment, but they almost always stop inviting friends when those issues are present.

]]> By: Marty Duren http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99588 Marty Duren Fri, 15 Jun 2007 11:52:59 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99588 Michael- Thank you for your gracious "honoring." It's like getting a handwritten note from Billy Graham. One small correction: <i>SBC Outpost</i> is leaving the blogosphere, but I am not. I'll be introducing a new blog on Monday. Thanks, man! Michael-
Thank you for your gracious “honoring.” It’s like getting a handwritten note from Billy Graham.

One small correction: SBC Outpost is leaving the blogosphere, but I am not. I’ll be introducing a new blog on Monday.

Thanks, man!

]]> By: Bene D http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention/comment-page-1#comment-99403 Bene D Fri, 15 Jun 2007 06:18:10 +0000 http://www.internetmonk.com/archive/in-honor-of-marty-duren-a-hopeful-look-forward-to-reformationrenewal-in-the-southern-baptist-convention#comment-99403 SBC Outpost isn't the only one. 12 Witnesses is also. SBC Outpost isn’t the only one.
12 Witnesses is also.

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