Comments on: Bisexual Logic and Gay Determinism: Does the rhetoric match the reality?

By: Phillip Winn

Phillip Winn — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

Excellent thoughts. While I bow to your greater experience, I will say that my own observations have tended to mirror yours.

By: anonymous

anonymous — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

Well, this is anecdotal, but a good friend of mine has spent literally decades trying not to be gay, and nothing worked. He’s given up. My guess is that this is probably fairly common.

By: iMonk

iMonk — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

OK anonymous…..where did I address that issue in this? I didn’t address it. Not at all. I know those people too. And I know people who have gotten involved in homosexual behavior then and quit doing it. What can I say? It happens. Gays who say all gays are born that way have to decide where these people fit in and how it affects their case.

I am not trying to bad mouth gays with the usual line that all they need to do is repent.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

A little defensive, are we? Probably some people can go both ways. Hell, I’m straight, but I’ve had a few homosexual erotic dreams–rare, but they’ve happened. I’m sure it would have been sinful for me to have had gay sex, in part because for me it couldn’t have been more than a meaningless experience. But the theological problem if homosexual acts are inherently sinful is what to say about those people we both know who have tried extremely hard to change and have failed and who want to commit themselves to one person for life. I know someone like that too–she got married to her partner and is one of the most decent people I’ve ever known.

To forestall another outburst, I know you’re not denying that gay people can be incredibly decent human beings.

By: iMonk

iMonk — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

It’s not an outburst, anonymous. (Gee…do some of you people have a soundtrack on your computer?) I just know that I am going to get nuked anyway for what I’ve said, and I prefer to be clear about what I did not say.

So you forestalled “another” outburst.

By: iMonk

iMonk — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

I apologize for taking your comment as implying I was saying gays should change. It was an over reaction on my part. Sorry.

By: Diane R.

Diane R. — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

Good post. I have two observations.

First, I changed my belief about being born gay after reading over a period of years about both non-Christian gays and ex-gay Christians and how they felt this attraction to the same sex when they were 5,6,7 years old. This isn’t all gays. But for the former, did they “choose” to be that way at that age as most churches teach us?

Second, in the passage in Romans 1, the words men and women as in God gave men and women over to their homosexual passions are adult men and women in the Greek as contrasted to more generic words for any age male and female that Paul could have used.

Third, when people are in Christ, there is deliverance. There is no excuse for this behavior or EVEN the feelings. IMO we have way too many celibate homosexuals and lesbians running around the church because the church hasn’t a clue as to how to deliver these people (yes I know you hate this topic..LOL). So their answer is to just “don’t do it.” I don’t think God is real impressed since He looks on the heart.

By: Jake

Jake — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

“don’t do it” seems like a pretty decent and scriptural method to avoid sinning. Celibacy for a sexual act that cannot be carried out in a righteous and correct manner is a good thing and I think God is pleased when His children abstain from immoral acts. As far as deliverance is concered, God will deliver us all eventually one day.

By: anonymous

anonymous — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

Was the apology aimed at me? I was coming online to apologize to you for my slight snarkiness. Dang, what a pathetic flame war this was. (Which is fine by me–flame wars are boring tedious things.)

I used to be pretty conservative on this issue, but when I got to know the gay people previously mentioned, it gradually turned me into a liberal, for better or worse. I’d say more about what I think about the conservative evangelical stance on this issue, but am not sure what your position is and anyway, I don’t have much to say beyond what everyone has heard ten million times anyway.

To the extent that I post around here at all (only a handful of times), I usually post with my name attached, but have to be paranoid since I’m using half-closeted friends as examples.

By: iMonk

iMonk — Thu, 01 Jan 1970 00:00:00 +0000

http://www.internetmonk.com/gayold.html

This is probably the best explanation of my views on the subject.